Red Flag laws are unacceptable. I’ll even go so far as to say that they go beyond unacceptable and that they are wrong and outright evil.
Now, that may seem like an extreme position to take on the issue (and anti-gunners would have you believe that any opposition to red flag laws is evil and irrational), but it doesn’t take long to see this truth if you take a few moments to think about the issue.
The simple reason that red flag laws are evil is that they violate your right to due process. In other words, they allow government to trample you and your rights without you being able to prevent it. Ryan Frasor writes,
by their very nature, [red flag laws] are the antithesis of due process. They require guns to be taken and constitutional rights to be deprived by the government before anything that resembles an adjudicative process kicks in.
There is no way to preemptively confiscate someone’s private property or deny constitutional rights based on a mere accusation while protecting meaningful due process.
Of the 17 states that have already passed “red flag” gun confiscation laws, none provide for pre-seizure due process.
In fact, even policy makers in Ohio, who initially supported the concept of “red flag,” found the actual process of drafting one in response to the Dayton shooting to be “unworkable.”
In every state that has a “red flag” law, the subject may only challenge the issuance of the order and beg for their rights and their guns back after seizure of the firearms has occurred and after the initial ex parte (one-sided) order is issued against them.
This is not adequate due process; rather, it should be a fatal flaw for any policy expert who claims to support the Constitution.
So what you have with red flag laws is a situation in which your guns can be taken (typically because an anti-gunner reports you as unsafe because they don’t like your private gun ownership), and then you have to pay upwards of $100,000 – $150,000 in legal fees for the possibility of getting your firearms back.
And all this happens even though you’ve done nothing wrong.
So, yes, red flag laws are evil. They prevent someone from exercising their Constitutional right to keep and bear arms, and they also can prevent a person from having access to their firearms for self-protection (just imagine a criminal calling in a red flag “tip” to get guns taken away so that they can break into a house to steal or assault someone without risking being shot. It will happen). And this is why we must oppose all red flag laws without exception.
Red Flag laws, can work sometimes. But the danger is that people can abuse them by making mean accusations against someone they dislike. As such,we cannnot accept them at all.
That depends on what you mean by “can work”. Yes they can and actually do confiscate guns from the rightful owner. In at least one case it also ‘worked’ to kill a gunowner. Now if by “can work” you mean to stop someone from committing a crime there is ZERO evidence of that. In fact, they are not designed to stop a crime. They are simply designed to confiscate guns and if the owner insists on protecting his 2nd amendment rights by resisting then to convict on felony charges, thereby making them a prohibited person due to another unconstitutional law.
they can never work
Can you say unconstitutional in many ways
They against the 2 amendment & have no good use except for the criminal no use for them
They against the 2 amendment & have no good use except for the criminal no use for them
‘red flag laws’ or ‘erop’ are ANTI-American. In Montgomery County in Maryland, a gentleman was assassinated by the cops when “serving” this CONFISCATION ORDER. Why was the order placed? A relative of the DEAD man had a disagreement earlier in the day. THIS is why the CONFISCATION ORDER was issued by a “judge” who did not provide ANY – – DUE PROCESS which IS REQUIRED by the COMMON LAW SYSTEM. Unfortunately, the Maritime Law System has been FOISTED UPON Americans in a SUBVERSIVE manor.
Laddyboy, I am familiar with this case, being a resident of the “grate” ( as in grate on my nerves ) State of Maryland. This incident was in Anne Arundel County, not Montgomery. The gentleman’s sister was concerned he would harm himself and filed for an EROP. At 5:00 am the police banged on this man’s door,which he answered as any of us would at that time of the morning carrying his handgun. Officers informed him they were there to confiscate his weapons, he said not without a warrant, police told him to lay down his gun, he refused, a backup officer fired his service weapon and killed the homeowner. So far as I have heard there was NO investigation into the use of lethal force, or backlash against the officer!
This is what happens when you empower assholes with badges and judicial robes and elect politicians that are communist shit hooks.
Red flag laws are an extension of the existing civil/federal asset forfeiture laws and all of them violate the 4th amendment. There is NEVER an acceptable reason to violate the Constitution! Civil/federal asset forfeiture laws are at the discretion of a law officer but red flag laws extend these unconstitutional practices to include any initiator. Vote out any elected official who supports them! Sadly we must weigh the alternative when doing so though.
What we need is an honest victim of red flag laws, one who isn’t actually a danger (hard to determine) to sue the state and take this to the supreme court. At that point, it should be overturned on the basis of no due process and on the basis that every state already has laws on the books for limited psychiatric evaluations, which would serve the same purpose to remove the individual from the location with the firearms.
Although not a gun owner myself, if you’re in a “red flag” state, the answer is looking you right in the face. All you need to do, is anonymously report one (or more, if you want to see if they’ll really confiscate), of your state lawmakers as potentially dangerous shooters. If it works, get your friends and neighbors to report every member of the legislature, I think you’ll get your point across. Also, that will give you the chance to test their claim that reporting is anonymous.
That’s good as long as there are no laws written in to go after the accuser? But the one I seeing preformed is to make an accusation and have a Large group waiting for them to show up! Have media alerted or have someone video it to show the cops that there can be consequences to illegal laws and for sheriffs they’re voting against them! Or it can get ugly?
that should really get their heads out of their asses.
There are NO constitutional gun control laws. Period. Full stop. That includes the NFA, NICS, excise taxes, etc. The 2nd amendment even states that it SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. Nowhere in the amendment is there any mention of “but”, “unless” or “except”. Every Red Flag law I have read about uses the phrase “harm to themselves or others”. No government has any authority to prevent a free person from committing suicide. As we have recently seen yet again, government is also apparently unable to prevent suicide even when the person is incarcerated. Absence an explicit threat and the ability to carry it out, how do you foretell the future? Example Person A threatens to kill Putin. Person A has zero weapons, no passport, no money and doesn’t know where Putin is. The threat is there but not the ability to carry it out so Person A should not be subject to Red Flag law. Person B has a weapon, passport, some money, knows Putin is in Russia and says ‘someone should take care of Putin.’ The ability is there but not the threat so Person B should not be subject to Red Flag law. Person C says ‘Chicago Mayor Lightfoot should be shot.’ Person C lives in Chicago, has rifle with scope, is an expert shot and has prior convictions for violence. Person C should be brought in and thoroughly questioned, taken into court and adjudicated. No Red Flag law necessary.
Your person C should not have a firearm in the first place according to the state of Illinois …
They have convictions for violence which means they CAN NOT get a FOID card meaning they can’t own a firearm …
WHOLE DIFFERENT SET OF CHARGES …
I do get your point …
Red Flag Laws aren’t meant to be acceptable . . . It’s only a (predictable) “knee jerk” reaction to a major problem. We don’t have a need for gun control, but “NUT CASE” control which these RED FLAG laws don’t solve. But, looking deeper, this is a subtle means of eroding our 2nd Amendment rights by ushering in Socialism/Communism. These “Red Flag” laws MUST be eradicated, AND we need to keep an eye on our neighbors, not IMPLICATE them for “wrong doing” that they DID NOT do.
In theory they sound great , take the weapon away form those intent on killing …
But realistically think about it , anyone can say anything bad about you plus its a violation of the Constitution’s DUE PROCESS …
I’m love them comment about ratting out there legislators to have to jump through their hoop they are implementing, even though i detest rat some on some, but I’m starting to think these legislators are just mind controlled robots not people, like democrats, some one needs to issue hunting permits LOL OK a guy can dream right
They are communist control freaks.
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